The Mindful Coach

Podcast

 

Get ready to hear inspiring stories, learn powerful coaching skills, stay updated on the latest technology, and gain insights from conscious marketing experts. Tune in to ‘The Mindful Coach’ podcast with host Brett Hill as he interviews an incredible lineup of coaches and helping professionals in the The Mindful Coach Association community.

Are you a coach or helping professionals who values mindfulness in life and work? Meet your colleagues in weekly meetings, list your services and who knows? You could be a guest on the show! Free membership.

Join the Mindful Coach Association

Many coaches and therapists want to grow their businesses to reach more clients but are blocked in marketing. Promoting your services often raises fears of judgment: “What if people don’t like me?” or “How can I focus on just one niche?” 

Using mindfulness, we can separate our identity from our offers. The success or failure of a marketing message is simply feedback about the marketing,  not you. 

And for those of you who feel that focusing on a niche is just too small for what you do, tune-in for suggestion that can truly reframe the “that’s too small” point of view to one that allows you to fully inhabit your work in a niche, without feeling like you’re giving up a larger part of your work.

As strange as it may sound, marketing serves a higher purpose when you serve a higher purpose. 

In today’s world, marketing is a means of sharing your gifts with people who need them. Instead of experiencing marketing as a dreaded task, it becomes a crucial part of your mission.

Listen in to hear:

  • Strategies to work through inner blocks to marketing
  • Mindset shifts to align marketing with your mission
  • The case for starting a niche when building your coaching business
  • Where to find help with technical aspects of marketing
  • Inspiration from a mindful marketing expert

00:00:00 Introduction to Mindful Copy Agency and Marketing Challenges

00:01:53 Overcoming Resistance to Marketing

00:04:53 Approaching Marketing as a Necessary Task

00:06:44 Embodying Resilience as a Coach

00:08:24 Overcoming Marketing Resistance and Authenticity

00:10:05 The Importance of Niching in Marketing

00:12:30 Step-by-Step Marketing Strategy for Coaches

00:16:05 Finding Target Audience Online

00:17:25 Balancing Authenticity with Niche Selection

00:19:48 Navigating Career Choices and Passions

00:22:19 Foundational Steps in Marketing Strategy

00:26:22 Mindful Marketing Course Overview

00:26:45 Addressing Technological Challenges in Marketing

00:29:12 The Significance of Email Lists in Coaching Strategy

00:29:44 The Importance of Building an Email List for Online Business Growth

00:32:23 Utilizing Personal Experience to Understand Consumer Behavior

00:33:07 Connect with Mindful Copy Agency for Marketing Services

00:33:46 Endorsement of Simona Andre Koba’s Mindfulness Marketing Services

Connect with Simona The Mindful Copy Agency or on Linked In

If you’re aligned with this message and mission of being more mindful in your work with people, join like-minded professionals at The Mindful Coach Association

Transcript

[00:00:00 - 00:00:37]So, hello and welcome to this edition of the Mindful Coach podcast. I'm your host, Brett Hill. And today I'm delighted to have Simona Andrekova of the Mindful copy agency, the founder of the Mindful copy Agency, which is going gangbusters and helping people, mindful coaches and healthcare professionals and all kinds of people who are involved in aligned with mindfulness find their way through the maze of marketing and helping them give them voice to reach the world in a mindful, conscious way. And I'm really excited to have her here. Welcome to the podcast, Simona.

[00:00:38 - 00:00:46]Thank you, Brett. It's great to be here. You know, I always enjoy your work and the wisdom you share, so it's great to be chatting with you again.

[00:00:47 - 00:01:52]Well, thank you. And it's always fun, you know, just behind the scenes, you know, whenever Simone and I get together, we could just talk for hours about, you know, how to help coaches in the planet, all over the planet, coaches, therapists, counselors, anybody who's engaged in a role where they're helping other people and they want to do it mindfully, they want to do it consciously and ethically. And the problem of, like, well, so many coaches, because I'm the founder of the Mindful Coach association, I also teach coaches with the mindful coach method. And so I'm deeply involved with what do coaches want in the world, how and the struggle that we all have in trying to get the word out about who we are and do that in a way that feels good, because so many times, I'm sure that you hear this, too, Simone. It's like coaches go, I don't like marketing, or I just don't feel comfortable with it. And I just wanted to ask you, how prevalent is that particular issue with you? And what do you say to somebody who says, hey, you know, I know I need to do some marketing, but I just. I just don't feel aligned with marketing at all. What do you say to someone like that?

[00:01:53 - 00:04:17]Absolutely. I get that a lot, actually. I would say 95% of the time. It's rare to talk with a business owner, regardless of how long they've been in the business, who doesn't feel a bit either intimidated or confused or nervous about marketing. And I think the biggest thing is that there's actually a biological thing going on in the background with our brain trying to protect us. And so when we do marketing, it's usually associated with us having to promote ourselves or our services. And so when we promote ourselves, when we talk about something that we've created, that we want to share with others. There can be this underlying fear of, like, what if people judge me? What if they don't like this? And so our brain is kind of trying to prevent that from happening, so it naturally resists us putting ourself out there. And so I think it's a completely normal reaction to thinking about marketing or promoting ourselves because it's just this biological need to fit into our tribe. And when we speak out, when we express ourselves, when we show off something that we've created and let people know that it can help them, it can bring up those feelings of what if they don't like it? What if they don't like me? And then it's hard to. Sometimes it's hard to delineate between our personal identity and then the business. And so this is one of the ways that. That I suggest that individuals can work with that. It's like, if you have that fear of promoting yourself, see if you can separate and actually use mindfulness to kind of look at those thoughts and beliefs as they're happening and separate yourself from the work that you're trying to bring to people. Because there, if people do, for some reason, say no or, you know, don't like it, it's okay. It's not you. It's just feedback about the offer you're making or about the message that you're sharing or about something that maybe they don't necessarily need right now. But you can use that feedback then to make your offer, to make your business better. And you are just the channel that delivers those services in that business. So it can actually be an exciting way to grow personally and professionally.

[00:04:18 - 00:04:51]I see. So what you're suggesting, if I got this right, is that the coach or the professional kind of get actually mindful about their response to things. And in the work I use, I would say, almost create some separation around the act of marketing and your identity. So it's not like who you are if someone doesn't like it, and so you don't feel so on the spot. It's just something that you're doing. It's just a. It's just be really kind of scientific and objective about it in a way.

[00:04:53 - 00:05:58]And it can be looked at as any other things in life that sometimes we have to do that we don't really want to do. Right. Like, I don't think a lot of us enjoy doing our taxes or the laundry or the dishes. Okay. If I don't do it, then there's going to be consequences. And so with a business, it's like when you're taking care of a business, it's part of that. It's an inevitable part of having to keep your business going is to market and promote yourself, even though it's like, oh, I don't really want to do that today. Then for the benefit of the business, for the benefit of the people that you're wanting to serve with your coaching services, can you be like, okay, fine, I'll roll up my sleeves today and I'm going to put together that social media post or send out that email or show up on a YouTube video or on a podcast. And just remembering that it's not for you, that it's for the higher good and the higher benefit of the people that are going to be helped with your work, it makes it a little less hard to get into it when you initially don't feel like it.

[00:05:59 - 00:06:44]Yeah. So I really appreciate that point of view where if you were to align around the work load and the tasks of getting those things done, where it's not just this onerous burden of, oh, my God, I have to sweep the floor to keep the house clean, but it's actually part of your mission. It's actually part of your, I want to help people and I want, and if you feel called to help others in a way that's kind of really core and central to who you are, that this becomes a part, an inherent part of your mission. And so rather than looking at it like, oh, it's a gotta do, and I don't really like doing it, it's more like it's a must do and it's in. I'm excited to get the word out there so that I can be more successful.

[00:06:44 - 00:06:44]Yeah.

[00:06:44 - 00:06:49]And the somatic shift there is dramatic, right? It's really dramatic.

[00:06:49 - 00:08:23]And especially for coaches, you know, because coaches generally help people grow on a personal, emotional, mental level. And a lot of that comes with learning to be more resilient, learning to be more comfortable with discomfort in a way so that we can grow. And so as a coach who is trying to do this work, if you feel that resistance of not wanting to do something that you know will ultimately be good for you, kind of like, you know, if you don't feel like going to the gym in the morning, even though you know you should, how can you work with that and then become an example for your clients or your prospective clients? It could even become part of your marketing. You could show up in your marketing and be like, hey, you know, I'm a, I'm a coach for busy women. And as a woman, I have struggled with this and this, and I also sometimes struggle with marketing my own business. And so by showing up in a vulnerable way, you can then talk about, okay, but this is how I work with it. This is how I deal with that when it comes. And then you become the example, then you embody some of the things that you want to teach people so that you're not kind of telling them, oh, you should do this and this, but then you have a hard time applying it to yourself. Which, I mean, I'll say, you know, straight up, that I sometimes advise people to do things that I'm like, okay, I know I should be doing this more consistently. I know it in my head, but something different to try to apply it to yourself, it's like, okay, I'm still learning to apply this piece, but it's much easier for me to tell someone else to apply it.

[00:08:24 - 00:10:04]Yeah, I totally hear that. You know, it's like, we know what, you know, we all struggle with the same, how do I prioritize my day sort of things. And sometimes we just don't want to do the things that we know we need to do. And that's just part of being human, I think, to, you know, keeping in focus the kind of obstacles, inner obstacles, to, like, taking effective action, you know, coaches like, so there's this resistance that can be related to, I don't want to be judged, and then there's also can be resistance to, I want to be sure that marketing feels authentic and connected to who I am. And so very frequently, I'll encounter coaches, including myself, who we can help a lot of people in a lot of ways, but it's the general marketing advice is you don't want to hang out your sign or you don't want to do your marketing saying, hey, any human on the planet with any problem whatsoever, what I have is going to help you. But when we start to be more specific, it's like, it seems to me in this, I'd be interested in feedback on this, that the marketing advice is to, like, let's get really, really, really focused on people who, like, let's say, women in middle management who have recently lost their jobs and that's the market that I'm going to go after and nothing else. And that can be really helpful for them, but it feels maybe a little too small for the coach's mission. What do you have to say to creating marketing for someone like that who feels like they're just bigger than any particular message?

[00:10:05 - 00:12:29]Thank you. I think that's a really important topic to highlight. It's basically this idea of niching, as we call it in marketing. It's picking a niche and then becoming an expert in that niche and then expanding from there. So especially for business owners or coaches or anyone that's starting out, the reason that I advocate having a niche, even if it feels small initially, is that it gets your name out there as someone who really understands that space and it allows you to get your first few clients or to really grow that business to a level to where once that basic need of the business is met, where you have the clients that you need to have the income that you might need, then you can start expanding beyond that. Because now you have proof that maybe these middle aged women love working with you and that you've helped them transform their lives. Now you've got testimonials and social proof and you can say, okay, great, I've been able to help this certain part of the market, but of course, I can help a lot more people than that by applying the same principles in a different way. And so then you can point to your success in that field and kind of expand from there, because then you might take the angle of, okay, I've helped women in this type of niche and now I can also help women who maybe are working moms or something that the coach can relate to. And the authentic part here comes in if they have personal experience with that, and that's where it gets really fun to then share their experience with their struggles of what they've gone through and why they understand. And that's where that connection is made between the people that you're trying to market to and you as the marketer, because you're not just faking and saying, oh, you know, I understand how hard it is to be a woman in management. You know, you've been there so you can provide clear examples. And so when someone looks at your website or at your social media and they read your experience, they're like, yes, she gets me. She's been there. So that's really the benefit of niching down and then later expanding. And that's what allows you to share your experience and your message without thinking that you're just making something up, that you're not going to be authentic.

[00:12:30 - 00:12:49]So what you're saying is that, you know, pick it. Pick a small group or a segment that you can really step into with some personal authority as well as expertise, provide a value to them. And then once you've got that social proof and the evidence and your business going, then you can expand into other.

[00:12:49 - 00:13:59]Areas because if you try to do it the other way around, then your message isn't really gonna talk to a lot of people directly unless you're really getting yourself out there in front of like thousands, hundreds of thousands of people. So it's really a matter of also your budget and your resources. Right. So if you have money to spend on ads, like thousands of dollars a month to spend on ads, and, you know, you've got people on your team helping you with promoting your message and sharing your services, and you have someone who's really helped you differentiate yourself, then maybe you could try the more general approach. As you know, I'm a coach for everyone. But if you don't, then if you want to start organic and on kind of a smaller budget, then that is the best way to start is to really make yourself known in that field. And then you'll naturally learn more about that field as you talk to these people, as you learn from your conversations with not only your clients, but also perspective clients, because this is another big piece of marketing, is talking to prospective clients knowing that not all of them are going to sign up.

[00:14:01 - 00:14:53]Yeah, exactly right. So you can talk to your prospective clients and find out what it is that they are after. Like, what are they, you know, what lights them up in terms of where do they need help and what are they looking for? Super valuable. How do. So if a coach is like, you know, wanting to get started, they don't really have a plan. They don't really have. They kind of have an idea. What kind of a process would you, would you say, like, how do they prioritize what they need to do? How do they learn how they need to do what they need to do? Because there's a lot of stuff going on out there and, you know, and what kind of, they're sitting there with like, okay, I've got a coaching certification, skills and desire. Now what, what, what's the now what part? I hate to put you on the spot like that, but it's kind of, I think you might know.

[00:14:55 - 00:15:47]Well, so this is where picking the niche is going to be the number one. Once you know you have the coaching certification and you have an idea of how you want to help people, what kind of transformations you want to create for them, you have to know who you want to do that for. So the clearer the picture of who you want to help and how you can help them, that will then allow you to start doing market research. So that's the step. If they're at that crossroads of wondering, where do I start? It's market research. Market research means figuring out where does that type of person hang out online, especially if you want to market your services online. Do they hang out on LinkedIn, on Instagram, on Pinterest? And if so, what are some of the things that they're looking for? What are the challenges that they're struggling with that you can help them with?

[00:15:47 - 00:16:04]But how do you figure that out? You know, you're sitting here as a coach, you're not a marketing expert, and you're saying, you know, let's just say you're interested in people who have gotten laid off from work recently. How do you find out where they're hanging out?

[00:16:05 - 00:16:11]Try to find some people who have gotten laid off from work recently and ask them, which I know, right.

[00:16:11 - 00:16:12]That's a great idea.

[00:16:13 - 00:17:24]But for example, the way I would go about that particular example is maybe find like a Facebook group. Like maybe just try to type in Facebook and LinkedIn yourself in their shoes. Like, what would I be googling or searching for if that was my case? So maybe they're not going to be googling what to do when you're laid off, but maybe they're googling, okay, how to start a new career, how to start a new business. And so what are some circles where people like that hang out? What are they looking for at that stage? So think in terms of keywords and this is one of the things that, you know, then we could go down the rabbit hole of SEO and search engine optimization. But all it is is really thinking about what is that person thinking about and what are they typing into the computer to find people who can help them and what communities are they trying to join? And if you don't know, if you could find at least five people who fit that criteria and just ask them directly, like, hey, what are you doing now that this has happened to you, now that you're laid off, what are some of the things that you're looking up online and what are some of the struggles that you face?

[00:17:25 - 00:19:46]Yeah, so that's great advice. I know that when I work with, you know, I'm offering training for coaches and so I'm involved with the same sort of thing. Like what do coaches want? You know, what are they after in terms of how to grow their business and how to expand their skills? Because I'm not, I mean, you're, we're on a little different sides of the same sort of thing. Like, we're trying to help coaches. You're helping them with their business, and I'm trying to help them with skills. And so it's like, but still, it's the same audience in a way. And so what moves people to engage with skill building and what moves people to engage with marketing, you know, from your seat, and then what moves the coach who's actually trying to market what moves their audience, whether it's people finding new jobs or people with depression or neurodivergence or whatever it is that their expertise is in, and then crafting a message that appeals to that particular audience. It's powerful work, and it's important work. I think the another way I think about this, and I'd be interested in your thoughts on this, whenever I encounter coaches who go, well, I just, you know, it just feels like anything I have to do, any niche, just feel like shoehorning myself into a box that's too small for me, and they start to feel unauthentic or it's, like, not really accurately representing. One of the ways I've been thinking about this lately is as if I was, because I, you know, I'm raised my hand. That's me. That's the way I feel, because, like, I do work with coaches, but I could do a lot of other things, too. And so one of the ways I've been thinking about this lately is as if I was, like, a movie producer or a novelist, and I have more than one book in me, and I have more than one movie in me, right? So it's sort of like you look at the arc of Steven Spielberg's work or, you know, Cameron's work, and it's like, there's more than one movie, and no one movie is all of you. So sometimes if I think like that, oh, then now I can commit to making this one chapter in the arc of my work and not feel like, oh, I'm declaring a boundary here. I mean, that defines who I am, but rather just empowering me to express that particular piece.

[00:19:48 - 00:21:26]I love that. And I think that applies so much when we think about, you know, I think any of us, if we think about how we started our career or job right after high school or after college, right. We had to pick something. Maybe we had no idea. We're like, I don't know what I want to do. I had actually three things that I really wanted to do, but then I narrowed it down to something that wasn't even one of the things I was like, okay, I want to be practical. I'm going to get a degree in business and finance, so I can actually land a good job, make good money, and then, you know, if there's other things I want to do, I'll pursue them later. So I had to narrow it down. And it's so funny and beautiful how it actually turned out that I was able to do the business thing. And then I came back to my two other passions, which were writing. Journalism and psychology were my two other things I was thinking about. And so now I'm helping people by writing. And psychology is really like that mindfulness, mental health aspect of it. I get to write about it. I get to help people with it through my writings. So if that helps, then think about, you know, the time when you had to pick a thing for your career or for your job, and knowing now that you can start that new chapter. Like you said, you could do the thing for a little bit. And if that doesn't work out, oh, well, then you've tried it, you've given it your best, and then you can move on to the next thing. And in the meantime, you're going to learn so much. You're going to learn so much about the people that you didn't even think that they had problems with these certain things. And then you create offers for them, but it won't happen until you talk to them, until you interact with them and get the feedback from them.

[00:21:27 - 00:21:51]Yeah, exactly. So, and, yeah, so it's like you don't know what you're going to do and you have to kind of figure out your way a little bit. But you only learn that by actually doing things. And so putting it out there and then seeing how it works. So it's important to take, take. There's no substitute for taking action in this regard. And so at the mindful copy agency, what's that again?

[00:21:52 - 00:21:55]In life and in business. Right. There's no substitute for taking.

[00:21:55 - 00:22:18]Yeah, exactly right. And so at the mindful copy agency, then, what is it that you actually like? If a coach was to say, hey, how do I get get started with you guys? What's the process like? Do you mind giving us a little overview of, like, the arc of your work with someone to take them from where they just get interested to actually getting something out there?

[00:22:19 - 00:26:20]Sure. So it always starts with the initial discovery call, unless they already know exactly what they want to do. You know, some people do come to me and say, Simona, I have this idea. I want to write blogs about emotional intelligence in the workplace, and I've got an outline of the things I want to talk about. Can you write these blogs for me. In that case, I would still want to have a conversation because I want to know more about their tone and their perspective. But with most cases, it starts with a conversation about, okay, what do you want to do with your business? So we talk about these big picture things because it really is the foundation. Knowing your vision, your mission, your niche. Sometimes it feels like, oh, you know, that's just like stuff that I can do later. Let me just get to the meat of marketing and let me get to putting ads out there and to putting my offers out there. But if you don't have that foundation, then all those other things that you spend your time doing are not going to be as effective. So you're going to be wasting your time. You're going to end up feeling discouraged. So that's why I always bring it back to the basics. Okay, why did you start your business? Who do you want to help and what are your challenges in marketing? And then it usually turns out that a lot of people, even coaches, might have experience with many different forms of marketing, but they don't really understand the big picture of where things fit. So then that's where I try to find what is this missing piece? So sometimes they've done a lot of social media stuff, even if they don't enjoy it, they've posted on social media or they have a nice website, maybe they've hired someone to design and even write the website and now they don't have, now they've been putting out posts, but they don't have a way to stay in touch with those people, for example, through email marketing. So then they reach out to a person once or maybe they send them one message and they're like, hey, here's my thing. Come to this thing. But in marketing nowadays, it takes, the number is around 14 touches before someone is actually ready to sign up to work with you. And I think it implies even more in the field of coaching because it's such a personally delivered service. So anyway, when I talk to coaches or other people who are interested in expanding the marketing, it starts with the conversation of, okay, what is your goal? Who do you want to reach? What have you tried? So anyone listening to this, if you think about all of those things and you know who you're trying to reach, you know your vision, you know your mission, you're clear on your offers and you've done some market research. What have you tried and what are the numbers? What are the results? What have people not responded to and what have people responded to? And then we would go through some of the main aspects of marketing. So website, I'd make sure that it's nice and organized and that it speaks to the audience, their social media, are they actually doing the social media work on the right platforms that their people are even engaging on? Do they have an outreach strategy, which sometimes can be the hardest thing is to actually send messages or emails to people, inviting them to webinars, inviting them to free things. Next thing, do they have free things? Do they have lead magnets, do they have ebooks, do they have videos? Do they have educational content to basically provide value even before people start working with them? And then do they have a way to stay in touch with the people who are interesting in that free content? So when someone listens to that podcast episode or goes to that webinar, what's the next step? How are you going to nurture them to make sure that they eventually sign up? Because it could take months or years before they're ready. So all of those are typically things we touch on and then we identify one or two to kind of start with. So it's not too much, it's not overwhelming. And then I can either do their marketing for them or do it with them, or they can learn it themselves in my course.

[00:26:22 - 00:26:24]You have a course then?

[00:26:24 - 00:26:44]Yes, I have a mindful marketing course that talks about all of these different aspects of marketing and really helps individuals understand what all is needed within their marketing to reach their target market. So that way they're not just trying one thing or trying too many things that aren't applicable to their market.

[00:26:45 - 00:27:12]And what about the technology involved? Because a lot of coaches, they're not technical folk and, you know, I'm lucky in the sense that I am. And so that's not a problem for me, but it, but there are a lot of coaches that, you know, where do they even begin to create an email system that captures leads and they don't even know where to start with that. What do you have to say to someone who's looking at that kind of a situation?

[00:27:13 - 00:28:29]I would say there's two options, really. The only two options are either to learn it yourself and, you know, to use Google or either YouTube to figure out, okay, how do I find an email service provider? Or how do I create a services page on my website that shows three different membership options for people? And then the second option is to hire someone, right? And so with business ownership comes having to invest money into the business. It's like having a baby, right? You don't just not nurture it by not feeding it. And sometimes you might be able to cultivate the food for the baby yourself, but sometimes you're going to have to buy it and that's going to save you money. So within business, if you have the budget to be able to outsource some of these technical things, I highly recommend doing it. I've done it myself. I even remember one of the very first investments in my business when I first started, when I was setting up my Gmail account. You know, something so simple. You're like, oh, what can be so hard about setting up a Gmail account? But there are these things called, like, DNS servers and things that are way above my head. And I'm like, I don't know what to do about this. So I went on upwork and fiverr and I paid like $150 to someone to set that up for me. I'm like, oh, my gosh, like, why.

[00:28:29 - 00:28:39]Am I paying them? So you could get my copy agency instead of Gmail, right, as your domain, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

[00:28:39 - 00:29:11]On the back end to make sure your emails don't end up in spot spam. And a lot of things I think about there are a lot of technical stuff is just to either learn it yourself, find it on YouTube, or to hire someone, you know, hire a marketing coach like me, or go to upwork or fiverr for a very specific technical thing. And there's different budgets, so you can start with something like smaller until you can grow enough to where you can invest in more expert help or in more professional, professional help.

[00:29:12 - 00:29:43]And so in all of this, how important is it that this email list that you capture these emails, how important, in terms of the strategy for a coach, is that as a focus? Because there's just sort of like, you know, posting on social media and hoping that you catch some traffic that way. And then there's also, you know, like you said, having some alignment around your website and capturing email addresses. The intention there is to grow an email list. And how central is that to their overall practice?

[00:29:44 - 00:32:23]Well, it depends on if they're trying to get most of their business online or in person. If they are trying to grow their business online, then an email list is definitely very, very needed. Because think about what would happen if all of social media went away tomorrow. You know, and it's happened with Instagram and Facebook where it blacked out for a few hours and the world was flipping out, like, oh, my gosh, what are we going to do? No Instagram, no Facebook. If you're using your social media to market your stuff and you don't have those people's email addresses, how are you going to stay in touch with them? And also it's a way for them to start trusting you. So in my marketing course, I talk about this concept of the funnel of trust in marketing. They talk about marketing funnels, but for me it really comes down to deepening trust with your prospective clients until they get to a point where they're like, okay, wow, this person understands me. I think I'm going to try this course, even though I'm not sure, but the emails are what's going to get you there. So I have a great example of that myself. So I was looking at ways to start a business online with copywriting and marketing. Now, five years ago and I came across an ad and I signed up for this mini course that this lady provided. It was four short videos talking about how to start a business in these topics. And so I'm like, oh, this is cool. So I liked it. So of course I got on her email list as a result of watching those videos. Before that, I never heard of her. Just I saw the ad, signed up for the video and got on her email list. It took me, I think, ten or eleven months, really close to a year before I finally said, okay, I'm gonna try this course because at that time it was a lot of money for me and I was so hesitant to sign up. But one of her emails specifically, I remember she was talking about something that really hit home. She was talking about money mindset and some of the ways that she's overcome her own money mindset struggles. And I'm like, oh my gosh. Like, not only does she teach marketing and business, but she actually understands some of this behind the scenes, like, resistance stuff that goes on. I'm like, I really like her. So over time, that's what did it. So apply the same example to yourself. If you're as a consumer, start noticing. Why are you signing up for people's freebies? And what are the emails that really trigger you, either in a good way or in a bad way? And then why do you take action and see how you can do that for your people that you're trying to market to?

[00:32:23 - 00:33:05]Yeah, I love that advice. That's so powerful because you're really using your own somatic experience as a reference point. And I've had a similar experience with certain people. When I look at it and I start to notice, like the 10th or 11th touch, I start to get pulled in and I'm going, I just want to kind of engage with this and go farther with it. After they speak enough to kind of like where I'm at, it starts to feel like lots of little yeses leads to a big one, you know? And so that's really strong advice. I really appreciate that. So how can people find you in the work that you do?

[00:33:07 - 00:33:22]They can go to mindfulcopyagency.com or I'm on LinkedIn also. Simona Andre Koba. My name is. My last name is too hard to remember or to spell out. So we'll just put the link somewhere in the show notes.

[00:33:23 - 00:33:24]Oh, yeah, of course.

[00:33:25 - 00:33:45]And you'll find a list of my services and pricing. So if you want help with your website, with your social media, with your emails, or anything in marketing that you don't feel like doing, me and my team can do it for you. Or you can learn more about my marketing course as well, where you can learn how to do some of this stuff yourself.

[00:33:46 - 00:34:05]That's great. And I hope people do look you up because she does great work. So, and particularly since she's in the mindfulness space and helping specifically with people who are oriented, aligned with mindfulness practices and principles. So we really appreciate the work that you're doing, and it's great to have you on the show.

[00:34:06 - 00:34:11]Thank you, Brett. It's been fun. I know we could probably go on talking for hours, but, yeah, we'll see.

[00:34:11 - 00:34:18]We absolutely could. And we'll talk soon. Yay.

[00:34:19 - 00:34:19]Thank you.

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